Garrett Masiulis: Unique Ownership Equity Partners with Herron Real Estate

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Garrett Masiulis: [00:00:00] oftentimes agents, they're looking for brokerages to solve
their problem.
But they have to take ownership of their problem and solve it themselves and then see
which one of these brokerages will help them Where it'll be a harmonious like help them
with their solving their problem, right? But they have to understand that they have to
kind of take the reins and do the work . There's so much to do in real estate. We fool
ourselves into thinking we had productive days just because we were doing things all day.
Tracy Hayes: Welcome back to the Real Estate Excellence podcast. Today, I have a
Jacksonville native who is passionate about assisting buyers and sellers with one of the
greatest investments in their lives. He believes his team's success has come from earning
the trust of their clients by showing how tirelessly they work.[00:01:00]
He leverages connections with local real estate support vendors to assist their clients,
showing the value his team brings to the table. He has a master's in engineering. He has
worked on major projects here in the greater Jacksonville area. Let's welcome one of the
owner partners with Heron real estate, the Garrett of the Garrett group, Garrett
Masoulis.
Garrett Masiulis: Thank you. Good.
Tracy Hayes: Thank you. I've got that all right.
Garrett Masiulis: Yeah,
Tracy Hayes: I appreciate you coming on, Garrett. Sorry, Erica, couldn't make it. But,
you know, as we talk pre show, I really want to dig in and what you guys are doing over
there at Heron. And, and also obviously what, you know, you guys, you and Eric are doing
you know, promote your business so people get to know you guys.
Getting to know anyone, the easiest question is I kick off, you're from Jacksonville.
Where'd you go to high school though?
Garrett Masiulis: Yeah. So I'm from Jacksonville. I went to Orange Park High School. I I
was actually born in Minnesota, but moved here when I was like three, four months old.
And so yeah, I've been here most of my life.
I did have a little bit Of time away with my dad in Maine and Indiana [00:02:00] but So I
was here when I was young in elementary school moved away for a couple years came back
around middle school and have been Here since so I I call myself a native but maybe i'm a
little bit of an imposter because I wasn't actually born here
Tracy Hayes: Well, it well are your kids i'm sure we're born here.
My kids are born. Actually. My wife was born here She was actually one of the few for
that age group to because you know most of florida is You You know, immigrants from all
over the country, let alone the world, right? A hundred very, very few. Well, we're
meeting them more and more obviously as a, as our areas in such high demand, which is
great for us.
Garrett Masiulis: We need more Jack Jags fans that were born here. Yes. Everybody's an
NFL fan that's here. They're their team. Their first team is somewhere. State.
Tracy Hayes: Right. It's always important that the, the Jag season ticket holders, the
who's coming into town Yeah, right. To sell tickets. Sure. So you, you graduated from
Orange Park High School.
What w you, you obviously was engineering your first passion that you went right into
undergrad and in engineering, you knew that's what you wanted to do.

Garrett Masiulis: [00:03:00] Yeah. So I mean, as a kid I was. I was interested in science
in general. The funny story is about engineering, when I went to Orange Park High School,
my mom actually applied for me to join the engineering academy.
And she just surprised me with, hey, I got you in. I had no clue that it was even a
thing. But I was most interested, honestly, in astronomy and space. And then I got into
this engineering program, thanks to my mom. And fell in love with, like, applied science.
Engineering was my thing. It was my go to.
It was what I was good at, passionate about. And and really it was my focus. You know, I
got went to the University of Florida after Orange Park high school to get my degree
undergrad and graduate. Then I hit the ground running. I'm like a You know, when I had my
eyes set on something, you know, that, that was it.
And that was my laser focus. Of course, I'm sitting here talking about something else. I
diverged a little bit along the way, but that was definitely my passion.
Tracy Hayes: We talked a little bit though, pre show. I mean, you, you, you and your wife
are kind of, what do they call it? Ying and yang though, as far as from a, from a
personality.
And we can, we can dig into that and how you guys work with clients. You know, [00:04:00]
she's more the empathetic one and thinking you're more analytical and we do. You know, we
have you know, this area between the Navy and Northrop Grumman and so forth. We have this
a large engineering group plus with all the projects going on, brings in jobs and so
forth.
So we are working. There's no doubt in my 18 years of being in the mortgage business, you
know, in a good bit of that two thirds of that being in a call center dealing in volume.
And, you know, it's kind of like that kind of like office joke of you know, you're trying
to. win the sale. Right. And you're dealing with the engineer and they're like, send them
a spreadsheet.
You know, that's the joke, right?
Can you give me the numbers on what I put 5 percent down, 10 percent down, 15 percent
down, 20%.
Garrett Masiulis: Yeah.
Tracy Hayes: So it's, it's always been that way, but it's, it's, It is a different
mindset in what you're in what you're doing. And sometimes obviously if you, it's like
[00:05:00] the disc assessment, if you get it and understand how an engineer thinks you
can, yeah.
Garrett Masiulis: Yeah, , talking about that, really my wife is the anchor to like our
family and business, honestly, she, she does drive the she's that emotional support rock.
And so when we meet with people I try and fairly quick, very quickly understand like who,
who are they going to jive with the most? Right. And I've got to admit that most of the
time it's my wife. But when it comes to solving the problems and dealing with the tough
decisions and dealing with the high emotion, which there's a lot in real estate I, I, I
think that that's where I can kind of navigate the emotion, even though like.
She's probably better at dealing with it. I kind of helped them navigate through it and
get to an end point, but definitely I couldn't do it without her. Well,
Tracy Hayes: You know, I think one thing we're dealing with now, not that it's totally
new, but I think with the current market conditions and my wife being in real estate too,
so I hear, you know, I understand some, a lot of the deals right now have a lot of Parts
Garrett Masiulis: yeah,

Tracy Hayes: you know the loans do too if you talk to the loan officers right now There's
a lot of extra puzzle pieces But the putting the deals and negotiating and the [00:06:00]
contingency things that the different people want on each side then sometimes that's
where You come in and you kind of bring in the what do you call it rational sense like
okay Here's your options.
It's either A or B, man. You need, you know, type of thing and break it down.
Garrett Masiulis: Absolutely. So I look at myself as an educator. And so I tell everybody
when we meet for the first time that you're going to get no shortage of information from
me. It's my job to, and I'll go down every single rabbit hole. Like, I'm not going to
admit that or say that I know the answer to everything, but I will find it.
And and I do, and I, I don't know how to put that work in, but I want them to know that
this is their show. They're driving it. Let me educate them. I, I tell, I was on a
listing appointment yesterday and I told them, consider me like the Siri on the iPhone or
the Apple Maps. I'm going to tell you how to get from point A to point B and what I think
is the best direction to achieve your goals.
But there's a million different paths there, and I just want you to know if you choose a
different path What can you expect and it takes a lot? I mean I use data to try and help
that but data doesn't solve everything we [00:07:00] make emotional decisions So I got to
respect that and understand when the person I'm talking to is emotionally driven
Tracy Hayes: There's there's no there's a lot of statistics and things out there that we
choose to ignore Yeah, yeah,
Garrett Masiulis: brain that anybody's heard of if they've looked into the human
psychology and decision making, right?
Yeah, the crocodile brain is the one that really drives the show and so the data is there
and it's important But often we just throw that out the window, right? So right,
Tracy Hayes: right so You've worked on some I was looking at your linkedin and you know,
you're you with the engineering and different several couple different companies there.
But what what is it in? 2020 that Makes that leap into real estate out of out of
engineering where you've I mean you got a master's you so you got a ton Of schooling and
a lot of studying in there a lot of time involved in the make that jump over to real
estate
Garrett Masiulis: Yeah,
Tracy Hayes: yeah, exactly.
What was mom's response? Yeah, she's been super supportive,
Garrett Masiulis: too I've been lucky my wife and my mom along the journey have been have
been my [00:08:00] rocks for sure But the transition was a little bit unorthodox Because
I actually made the decision to start in real estate through the through investing back
in, in 2014, probably around 2013.
And I just had a conversation with my wife and I'll, you know, everybody at one point
sits down and says, I want to be a millionaire or, you 5 million, 10 million, whatever it
is. They have some goal and sometimes it's just a number that sounds good. And I think
for me, that's probably what it was, but it at least led me down the journey of how do I
get there?
Engineering is it, I work for a large, I work for a large corporate, you know,
engineering firm, national 33, 000 employees. And you know, in the corporate structure,
it's, it's tough, right? To make it to the top can take a lifetime. And anyway long story

short, we bought our first foreclosure in 2014 and we fell in love with real estate
investing, remodels, and things like that.
And looking for an agent to help us, like, with pursuing investing and growing a
portfolio, a mutual friend of David and myself, we, we, you know He basically said, Hey,
why don't you reach out to David? I actually worked with David [00:09:00] in a marketing
company when we were in high school. Nothing glamorous. Oh, wow In fact, it was like a
little bit of a marketing sweatshop.
So more goofing off than anything high school kids you could imagine but anyway, we we
connected and he's the one that opened my eyes to Helping buyers and sellers, right? The
traditional kind of retail market and not the off market investing side. We met up I was
kind of interviewing him so to speak just to catch up and say hey this is what i'm
looking for and he shared with me his his kind of vision of hair and real estate and so
In terms of getting into real estate as an agent and as an owner that that officially
kicked off in 2020 But my passion and my wife's passion was investing And and we just
went down the track and we really love everything there is To love about real estate.
Like we love the wealth building potential but we love helping people solve their
problems too. So buying and selling real estate it's a big deal. And it's a hard thing to
navigate. I mean, it's hard for agents sometimes to navigate. So can imagine somebody
trying to operate without an agent. So we love being able to help them out.
Tracy Hayes: Well, you said Erica [00:10:00] was teaching at the time and she decided at
what point does she join you? On air comes a point because we, we definitely have a lot
of X teachers that make that migration over. When does she decide to give up, you know,
any, anybody in, in, I think anyone who, I want to say the next day likes teaching.
I don't know if that but gets into that career generally wants that very secure
environment The w 2 the benefits they know when they're going to have their time off that
sort of thing How does she break and come over?
Garrett Masiulis: I'd love to tell you that this was like planned. It might be just a
byproduct of me being her husband because I'm, I'm constantly, you know, looking for
opportunity.
And so for her to just be completely honest we got pregnant with our first son in 2017
and me being the analytical guy. I look at the cost of daycare. Okay, and then I look at
how much my wife was making. She's fantastic at her job. That [00:11:00] is like, gosh I
wish teachers made more. Because it takes a certain skill.
And the way that she handles little kids is phenomenal, and mine, like, my kids are
lucky. They don't know it yet. They'll know it, but. It was just that quick, like, math.
Like, hey, what, what is you're gonna spend this time in school and it's really just
gonna pay for childcare, more or less. Right.
And so we decided as a family that she was gonna stay home. In fact we're really family
oriented to begin with, so we wanna be, like, We understand the importance of school. Of
course, I went through higher education. My wife was a teacher, but there's a lot that
you miss out on school, and we want we wanted to help control like the information that
our kids were getting.
And so we made we made that decision for her to stay home. And I know you asked about how
she got into real estate and really how she got into real estate is We we have a lot to
do in real estate and she's got some natural talents that align with real estate She
likes real estate gosh If you see what she's done on some of our rental properties that
she's remodeled She's really got a vision and her skill set's different than mine It
really didn't take much convincing.
She's been there with, she knows
Tracy Hayes: what the color, [00:12:00] what to paint the walls. She knows

Garrett Masiulis: everything. . Like if I'm, when I walk with a husband, I've got one
Tracy Hayes: of those too. Yeah. .
Garrett Masiulis: And then when I walk and show a house with a husband and wife, and then
I, that starts going into like the HGTV real estate. Mm-Hmm. like I'm talking about
interior design.
I do my best. I'm like, I, what did my wife say? say, what can I regurgitate? But no,
there's, there's a need for it. Right. And, and she's super talented at it. And it didn't
take much convincing. She, she was there with me the whole time and I just were like,
Hey, how do we make this work together?
And we figured that out. So awesome. It's been fun ever since.
Tracy Hayes: So the, the roles you've now have the Garrett group You know, when you guys
get that call, maybe, maybe a, a referral you don't know, or just a, you know, I don't
know, someone sees your sign or something. But when you're, when you're not given that
friend, when you're given a, the stranger that gets in front of you, how do you guys.
You know, start with the initial call. Who makes that initial call or, or, you know, do
you guys actually have some sort of you know, a [00:13:00] plan set out based on your
personalities and, and mindsets?
Garrett Masiulis: Yeah. So normally I do the discovery call. And I have consumed like
real estate knowledge through podcasts through primarily podcast YouTube channels.
I just, that's what I do, audio books and things like that. So I would say from like a
knowledge standpoint, understanding people's problems, it's kind of like my forte. It's
what I like. And so normally on that discovery call, I'm having the initial conversation,
but at the same time, I'm, I'm feeling the person out to understand.
Like would this person be better serviced by me or my wife anybody they get both of us,
right? But it's that face to face. It's like who's the person you're going to communicate
her, right? So like there's somebody that's working primarily with my wife still gets my
knowledge my Thoughts my opinions the data.
It's just going to be communicated through my wife and and normally we like she's like
the marketing designer mind. She's you know, dealing with social media, sending out, you
know, print marketing and things like that. But but there are people that really need
her. Like, in fact, like, even though I would give great service, in my [00:14:00]
opinion, the person is just not going to connect with me.
And although I'm generally the person that's like the point of contact, the second I know
that they'd be better served by my wife, we kind of know it together. We don't even have
to say it. Like, sometimes my wife, she'll overhear a call. And she's like, yeah, that
one's yours. It was by the questions they're asking.
Yeah. And then, and then it's vice versa. Right. Plenty of times I'll get off the phone
and. And I let the customer know that we're a team. They know like they're going to hear
from both of us. Right. But yeah. And so generally it's the discovery call. I'm there.
And we, we kind of just feel the person out.
Tracy Hayes: I mean, I imagine on a listing appointment, do you do more or do you both
show up?
Garrett Masiulis: Yeah, we do. We try to both show up. But oftentimes like we know enough
about the person we're meeting with before. And I am the data like that's, that's what I
know and love. And I try to always bring a little flavor of that just so they know that
they're dealing with a professional, somebody who's paying attention to the market and
isn't kind of, I don't like to go off my gut.

A lot of times. You know, that can get me in trouble to be honest. That's why I rely on
the data. So we'll go [00:15:00] together. But if it is somebody who's seems like they
might receive the analytical piece a little bit better I'll go solo.
Tracy Hayes: The jumping kind of down to my question, this is where you brought up data
and so forth.
The article came out from Florida realtors yesterday. I reposted it on my LinkedIn and I
thought it was just extremely interesting because talking about cash buyers and I, you
know, I've For the longest time, actually, I was up at our corporate office and the
president of town bank mortgage said, asked me what, what the percentage is cash.
And I said, well, I think most of people say it's in the thirties. I say it's probably
pushing 40, but 30 to 40%. And all of a sudden this article comes out here just a few
days later, that nearly 55 percent of the transactions in greater Jacksonville are cash
right now. And you know, how are you guys Cash buyers aren't always a slam dunk.
Garrett Masiulis: No,
Tracy Hayes: I've seen so many of these. They, they win deep. They generally move to the
top of the list, but then they're, they're first to flake.
Garrett Masiulis: Yeah.
Tracy Hayes: Yeah.
Garrett Masiulis: And yeah, I think the [00:16:00] number was even higher during the
pandemic in terms of cash buyers, but yeah, cash, it's interesting because that to the
seller. It's all money in the bank, right?
And what we try to do with whatever buyer we're working with is manage the risk for the
seller if we're on the seller's side. And although the cash generally comes with less
risk in terms of contingencies and things like that, you're right, they are the first to
flake and honestly when they bring the cash, they feel like they're in a different field
than the finance buyers and so oftentimes they want something in return for the fact that
they're bringing cash.
And so Like sometimes it's cash is great. But sometimes there's other home runs that are
that are my opinion better than cash But it is it is interesting to see You know not only
the amount of transactions that are done in cash, but where that transaction is coming
from You know, what are are they transactions where their resident current residents of
florida that are buying here Or where what other states might they be coming from because
jacksonville's population is is in growth mode and has continued to grow, right?
Right. Well, I
Tracy Hayes: was I I had I forwarded on to to my boss, she's [00:17:00] out in the
panhandle and she said, you know, out there she's, they're seeing a lot of 10 31
exchanges cause she's kind of on the beach where these people are buying the beach house
so they can Airbnb it when they're not there type of thing.
And I can, I swear, you know, I could see it'd be interesting, you know, may, you might
have these buyers that are in those Northern states that are saying, you know,
Jacksonville is a hot market. Let's sell our investment property here take that and buy
another investment property there because it has a higher Statistical data of a upswing
of equity, right?
Garrett Masiulis: Yeah, those coastal coastal markets like the one we're in You're gonna
get the peaks and the valleys more so than in the middle of the nation, right? And so
yeah, you're gonna see that a lot. It's in 31 exchange is a unique vehicle and Gosh, if
you get me on to this thing, this show could turn totally. But, but I do, I do, I do
think you're right.

You know, and somebody who's got the wisdom, the 1031 exchange to begin with, those are
savvy buyers, you know, and savvy buyers are, they're looking for deals. [00:18:00] And
if you just have the cash buyer and let's say it's some, it doesn't even have to be a
wealthy family, just for example, and they're just buying a house for their kids, you
know, that.
That may not be a savvy buyer. They're savvy if they're wealthy in some way, shape or
form. But when it comes to real estate, sometimes they just drop cash, right? And you
look at it as, as an agent and you're like, Oh my gosh, like I can't believe, you know,
it just doesn't make sense, but, but that's it. You get both varieties and cash, but
generally speaking, they are the first to flake, or I don't necessarily like the word
flake, but yes, what it implies is that they're the first ones to find the exit, right.
And say, I'm just going to take my, don't show up with
Tracy Hayes: the earnest money. Yeah. They, they I think I've had a couple. transactions
actually benefited. One was my wife's one was mine. And I was funny. I was telling my
wife about my, person who needed financing and they got beat out by the cash buyer.
And I was telling my wife, she immediately said, call them and tell them to be the backup
offer because these cash buyers are, have a high percentage of flaking out and sure
enough, Two days later guy calls me he says yeah, the [00:19:00] cash buyer didn't even
show up The the earnest money was due at five o'clock and called said we're out.
Yeah, and they never you know came up with so being the back of it we could let's let's
take a little bit because I think this investment site because I think you'll tell a
little about you and Erica and the Garrett group of What expertise because I don't think
enough agents are in
Silence: Own real
Tracy Hayes: estate.
Owning their own real estate. Yeah, they own their own house, but they don't, they're
not, I, cause I, from the finance side, I've, for years about, you know, getting
investment financing, you know, that type of thing. And I know that, and they're asking
questions because they've never dabbled in it or themselves and gotten involved.
And so what, give us a little insight on when you have that buyer who is looking for
investments, which I imagine because I know you do there, you probably have a little list
to say, Hey, if you find a hot property, let me know, you know, I want to Yeah, we'll
check it out. Type of thing. But your years is what roughly 2014 when you bought your
first foreclosure there.
And I mean, have you done [00:20:00] numerous flips? Do you hold what? What is your
attitude?
Garrett Masiulis: So when we got started, and this is primarily been our role when I was
in engineering, it was busy, many 80 hour work weeks, like just crazy busy. In fact, when
we had our first son, I don't think I saw him awake for the first three months.
And that was like eye opening saying that we put our family first and then saying I also
did that. It's like, I'm ashamed of it, honestly. Yeah. But so what we did originally was
we bought, we did like we would buy the house, we would live in it because we could
obtain attractive financing, right?
As long as it was financeable. So that can give you a little bit of an idea of the level
of distress that these homes were in. And back whenever we started in 2014, I mean, there
were foreclosures that the house, you The asset wasn't really in distress. It was the
person that was in distress, right?
So they would take care of the asset the house But they would have some sort of financial
hardship, right? Because we were climbing out of the recession and things like that and

these houses were being you know, they'd taken up back by the bank. And so we did like
live in flips. Okay, so we buy distressed property.
There was the stress. At the beginning it was [00:21:00] cosmetic. But we've done full
gut remodels as well, but we would buy it with attractive owner occupied financing. And
that was the reason we did that. One was because the, to, it was risky, right? And we
wanted to make sure that we have to pay to live anyway.
And so we were trying to hedge some risk there, but then the financing piece was a big
thing because when you look at cashflow in today's market and really any market, the
financing Can be the decider right it is in fact because like whatever your obligation is
from a debt service standpoint Is going to be a big decision maker, right?
And so that's what it was for us. We would buy we would do like these live in flips. You
buy the house, you fix it up. If you can live in it for two years. Great. Because then
that shelters you for the capital gains aside of things. Unless you're making a
ridiculous amount of money as a married couple, as long as we were under 500, 000 in
capital gains, we didn't get taxed on it.
And so we did that several times. We, we have sold everything that we bought except for,
we own two doors down in San Marco right now. Since I got to admit, since we opened up
here in real estate. We dabble in a lot of things, okay, and real estate's our core but
we have been [00:22:00] focused on growing here.
Here in real estate. We talk about ourselves, my wife and I, hair and real estate, the
company and our agents is our real passion and it's been that way since 2020. So if I
have a problem to solve for hair and real estate and a problem to solve for our agents or
for our customers, we find a way to make both work, right?
Because that's our, our passion lies for both. But we did in 2020 where we really are
focusing on. Kind of servicing agents more as a business, as a business owner, right? And
what can we do? I know we're, we're going to get there as well. Yeah. But the investing
side of things, it's been a lot of living flips.
We do buy and hold now. I told every time we bought something, I told my wife we're not
selling it and and then we sell it. And then the last two doors, we, we've meant it. So
we've kept it. In fact, the house we currently are living in as a, as another live in
flip. We bought it in February 22, so we've just hit the two year mark.
And we're, you know, we're looking for another opportunity. But that one will be a rental
as well, and we're just going to continue to slowly grow. Their rental portfolio,
Tracy Hayes: right? What are you seeing as far [00:23:00] as, you know, obviously the
interest rates are, are high, you know, we're getting calls. I'm sure you're dealing with
buyers who are looking at, you know, what their payment would be.
You know, if they were to buy and especially if they've got little money down are the
balance between where we're seeing rents versus the mortgage, you know, obviously two and
a half years ago, two years ago. Hey, you need to buy now. Are we seeing where the rents
and the mortgage payments, maybe the mortgage payments are a little bit higher right now.
Garrett Masiulis: Yeah. So everybody most people make decisions on money in each month
and money out each month. And, and I, and I tell everybody just like, you know, you
probably do, like rates are going to always change. And I get the question all the time
is now the right time to buy. And I am a firm believer that it's always the right time to
buy, right.
But but what you buy. Exactly what you buy, where you buy it, is going to be different
for everybody. Because you got to think about your family as its own little business. You
got to [00:24:00] manage your own personal finances and be comfortable with with what
you're going to spend, but you got to understand that rates fluctuate and just be smart
with that.

To answer your question about is it cheaper to own or cheaper to rent I'm going to
always, always, always push towards the owning side. There's a lot of benefits to owning.
You're going to get wildly different opinions. Like the house is the worst investment.
And it really is like the leverage in the debt.
It's important to understand the cost of money. But then understanding appreciation of
real wealth is really, is really generated in real estate. It isn't really the cashflow.
It's going to be. The appreciation standpoint, not all places appreciate the same. And
it's a very complex question to answer, but, but I, I still think that owning is, is the
way to go.
But renting is a great option. I just think renting should be considered a stepping stone
to, to own.
Tracy Hayes: Right. Well, I'm assuming when you're analyzing these properties and you
know, if you're going to hold or this house you're living in now, you know, you find
something next month and you said, go out, you're going to rent it.
Are you able to get the rent? To cover the note, you know, [00:25:00] or you know,
because obviously you bought this two years ago rates were lower than you know That type
of thing Well, obviously that mortgage is on there So that might make you know the rent
for that property because you have two rates from two years ago Versus someone, you know
buying an investment property today.
They're gonna pay have a little bit larger payment is those rents As I've had numerous
discussions, we were talking about Jordan forever. You know, she's, she likes to buy and
flip and, and, and rent as well. You know, that, that the, the balance, even because a
lot of people want cashflow, that's me to think, Oh, I'm going to buy and invest probably
want cashflow well right now you may not have cashflow because the rates are higher, but
you still have the high demand here.
You're still going to get that rent and you're still going to be building that equity
growth as they pay the rent. And then, you know, obviously. We know over time, the
appreciation is always one in real estate.
Garrett Masiulis: Yeah. The decision on, on like, what's a win for you is a personal
decision, right? And so I agree the places that I buy and in town or that I would ever
consider buying or places that [00:26:00] I would have no problem me personally living
in.
That's one of my criteria is my wife, myself. We have to have no problem living there
because we don't know what the future holds, the, you know, things could change and we
might have to live in a rental property. So that's one of our criteria, but the, but
what, and in those places you're not really gonna cash flow.
So that's why I'm saying every, you gotta look at your, your family as a, as a, as a
business and what can you support. So I will buy a. Zero cash flow property. Like today I
would buy a zero cash flow property because I don't need the cash flow, right? Like we
have different streams of income coming in from the different things that we do.
And I understand that the way that you build wealth is generally through appreciation,
but there's tax benefits to own a real estate as well. And the principal pay down by the
tenant. So I'm not going to buy a property that has, that needs my money on a monthly
basis to, to maintain the asset. But I'm certainly not going to sit here and say, I only
buy 15 percent cash on cash return rental.
Right. But everybody's got to make that decision themselves. Like what is, because real
estate's a long term play, unless you're flipping, right? [00:27:00] And if you're
flipping, you got to understand the real cost of flipping, which a lot of people don't,
but it's a long term play. If you're going to own a portfolio and you're not going to get
rich overnight, but it's that long term wealth building that's, that's so powerful.

And so if you don't need the cashflow, then you can be, you know, It might sound, you can
be a little bit riskier, I guess, in your decision making, but I'm not, I'm not really
risky but it's just because outside of the portfolio, what we're working with in terms of
what brings money into the family is okay, like I understand it.
Tracy Hayes: So the, this experience and, and, you know, obviously the knowledge that you
just spilled into us there and your, your Analyzation. Yeah. You're, you're, you're
breaking down the numbers and everything there. How has that helped you guys in your,
Real estate business and it's because the real estate agents that are listening right now
who are not Doing and they might not take it to the level that you guys are you're doing
it on the other But they need to dabble in and buy real estate themselves and look at
possible investment or you know Learn how to flip there's enough people in [00:28:00]
town.
There's enough people That can show you how to do it. They'll train, they'll let you
mentor with them or go in with them and you can watch, so you're not taking much risk
there and learn how to do it that, but they need to be involved because how has that
opened your horizon or the, the, the clients that you now deal with because they know
you're, you're in yourself,
Garrett Masiulis: right?
Yeah. And you can
Tracy Hayes: speak, speak knowledgeably. Yeah.
Garrett Masiulis: So bringing it back to an earlier question about. Our agents out here
in real estate or any agent, not enough of them own real estate. And it's a shame because
they are the ones that have direct access to real estate through the customers that they
work with or even referrals or whatever.
So they, all of the investors that are looking for deals You know, oftentimes they
overlook real estate agents, but we're the ones that have the pulse on the market. And so
you have like an unfair advantage that you can leverage and, but I am a strong believer
that you gotta, you have to Don't invest in what you don't know, right?
And just because you buy and sell real estate doesn't mean you know enough to start
investing. So what you said is getting [00:29:00] connected with somebody who does is
going to help accelerate that knowledge and the confidence. And so once you get to the
point where you, you can talk the talk, you understand it, you've invested yourself.
I highly recommend that, that you do that. Then you can help service other people who who
I think everybody, if you were to ask them, do you want to own real estate? That the
answer is yes, you want to be a real estate investor, even if I don't care what industry
they're from, I would say a higher majority are going to say yes.
And so the, the cure, do they
Tracy Hayes: do it or not? That's another thing because they don't know how to take that
next step, which is generally most people in anything, right? They have all, Oh, wow,
well this would be a great business, but you just don't know how to connect to the next
step. And
Garrett Masiulis: so even if you're dealing with somebody who would say yes to that
question, but their, their current problem is not investing.
Their current problem is fine. Buying a house or selling theirs. But if you can connect
with something that, that's like hidden deep in a lot of people that they have an
interest in real estate investing, that's a way to also build trust, right? Because that,
that's what we want to do. We want people to know that we got their back.
That we're educated, we're going to be professional. Trust me, I [00:30:00] know what I'm
doing. I'm here to give you advice that you may not always want to hear. Right? I'm not,

I'm not going to always give good news. In fact, I might give bad news more than good
news that sometimes, but just, just having that trust and, and having that experience can
help you build that trust as a professional.
And then in the future, if you can continue to work with them and help, help them realize
their vision not everybody's built for owning real estate, but if, but if this, if some
people are, and you can help them realize that and help them with that, it does go a long
way and current business and referral business.
Tracy Hayes: Alright, let's jump over to Heron. Okay. You said you were there with David
and Christine at the beginning. Yep. You guys have and, and this comes down because I
remember it was a couple years ago when you brought on the last couple as part of your
Ownership team, I guess you'd call it there.
And I remember Kathleen was advertising that you were looking for that thing in, in some
of the requirements that they wanted from that person that they would bring in what it
kind of give, I mean, what was you, I think you actually said Before the show David's
vision that he painted for you of what hair and real estate is because it is a little
[00:31:00] different and I, and I look at you guys and the other company we were
mentioning earlier that, that are big in recruiting.
Matter of fact, they've gotten, they're like, classes for, to try to get their agents
more involved in investing when you were talking about that. But, but tell us a little
bit about what, what was David's vision that caught your eye and said, I need to be
involved in this. And then how does that ownership team work and what's their
responsibilities?
Cause it's a little different than the average brokerage. Yeah, absolutely.
Garrett Masiulis: And so this is what I couldn't wait for this question. So the vision
and he would explain it better than me, but let me tell I can only tell tell it through
my lens, right? And so if I take you back to me getting connected with david and real
estate we were sitting together had a couple drinks talking about my what I wanted in
real estate investing and then david shared his his vision for this real estate brokerage
and The vision was cloudy at first probably crystal clear in his mind, but I had to take
some time to get oriented with this vision but You Really, the gist of it is this is
that, you know, David worked at [00:32:00] another broker, she and his wife and they've
never talked to the broker.
So that was like problem number one. They figured it out with a lot of anxiety and stress
and leveraging people that they knew in the business. I think
Tracy Hayes: a lot of, and there's a lot of agents in this boat even today. Yeah,
Garrett Masiulis: yeah, absolutely. And so they went through it and were successful. You
know, I don't have their actual numbers in front of me, but I think we can all agree that
they well, they're still in real estate today.
So they know us to had some success. They paid the bills. Absolutely. And and so that was
important for them is to make sure that, that, that we at Heron real estate. Operated
completely differently where we the broker was available, right? There was support and
but we also understood that the market is changing And I say we and it was really this
was communicated from David to myself or David and Christine in fact to myself And I was
you know, putting the pieces together analyzing it and trying to understand it And so
they, they understand that agents work hard.
It's a hard business, right? The traditional brokerage where you get leads from the
broker is like a way of the past. Yeah, you're still, there's still brokerages that do
that. But we, we believe that here in real estate that we, as a brokerage should teach
agents how to run their [00:33:00] own business, right?
Brand themselves, run their own business, generate their own leads,

Tracy Hayes: teach them how to fish,
Garrett Masiulis: right? Exactly. And if we're going to be doing that, we know that's a
lot of work. They just don't clock in or come into the office and we give them a lead and
tell them to go run with it. And these agents that are putting in that work they're
running their own business.
We wanted them to have the fruits of their labor, right? So we need, so that's why I hate
the discount brokerage kind of a label, but, but we're attractive when it comes to an
independent agent's financing or a teammate team or whatever, right? It's like, yeah.
because they keep most of what they make. But then that poses a problem, right?
Because they just said that they wanted to be able to be available and provide support.
And that comes in the way of training and many other things. But they also aren't going
to take much money as a brokerage. And as a business person, you're like, okay, like, how
does this work? Right. Take all
Tracy Hayes: my time and give me a little money.
Garrett Masiulis: Keep the office running and keep the business operational. And so this
is kind of where where we don't fit the mold because when David asked for me to be a part
of this, in fact, I wasn't even licensed at the [00:34:00] time and I was trying, I was
excited, a little nervous. I didn't know what I was signing up for, a little naive maybe
but bringing in equity partners or owners, what that does is it removes a paid position
or a salary obligation, right?
And you're able to provide support with a team. That now is we benefit if the brokerage
benefits and if the brokerage doesn't we don't right? It's a business owner position. And
so that was a way to control blood in the game. Yeah And and that their plan just to kind
of run you through it yeah, I I was the first one but it that doesn't make me the most
important by any means The team was picked in terms of really how well they fit with the
brokerage vision And our culture.
Okay. So like, if you were to ask me what I'm most proud of, what the owners are most
proud of it, it's the culture, like our growth. I would like to think is of course
there's a finance piece with the money, but it's really culture, you know, culture
driven. And each team member, each owner was picked with, with their talent in mind.
Like the second owner is [00:35:00] Amber Taylor and Keith Taylor. Right. And like, if
you've met Amber, I've invited
Tracy Hayes: her on, she hasn't accepted my invite. Yeah, if you, I'll do it for her,
Garrett Masiulis: okay? You would have to turn the volume down in here if she was in the
seat. She is like a ball of energy, okay? Like literally, if you look up energy in a
Webster's Dictionary Her face is right there, right?
Her talent is different than mine, right? And then alex and janelle johnson were next And
honestly like they were just agents at the beginning But you would have thought that they
ran the brokerage or owned the brokerage because they were providing so much support they
were always there helping to set up and Like they really did like act the way that our we
say that our culture is right?
And and so it really made sense and we went through the process and brought them on you
mentioned cat as well You I mean, Kat, she loves her spreadsheets. She loves her
processes. I mean, all of the women that we have are super powerful, strong, independent,
great real estate agents. And so she would, she was next and a unanimous decision amongst
everybody else that was already on board.
And then Erica and Laurent, I think you mentioned were our [00:36:00] final two and their
passion for like making sure that the experience at real estate or the experience at
hearing real estate that we put out the culture that we say we have is in fact what. Our
agents get and so they're often reaching out their agents regularly.

Just checking in that house business. How are things going? What what are you not getting
here that you thought you would get? Tell us the good the bad the ugly and we meet
monthly to get that feedback and and put plans in place to make sure that Like who we say
we are we actually are because sometimes you can get lost in business and kind of forget
that.
Tracy Hayes: Yeah Yeah, well, real estate can be that way and you could be with some of
these you know, there's some agents that thrive just because they just have a business
mindset or whatever, and they, you could throw them in at pretty much any brokerage and
they're going to go because they just go find it themselves.
There's others that I would say just an example, they may come from that corporate
America and have that nine to five mindset. Although I've had a couple of very successful
ones that came from corporate America and instilled that into there. And that's why
they're really good, but where you're waiting for the [00:37:00] assignment, you know,
type of thing.
And you could feel like you're on your own Island and you're is, is this happening to
other people and so forth? And I, and I think is real estate agents and even loan
officers, you need to have some Transcribed Level of water cooler talk or in your sales
meetings, let a This is happening to everyone if you have a cash buyer right now make
sure you have a backup offer because they're you know, these are the things that we
discussed earlier that you need to share those little things because You you can be on
your own little island in real estate And and if your broker is not reaching out or the
owner's not reaching out and just saying hey What's going on or you're not coming into
the office regular to get a little bit of that water cooler dog you?
Think it's only happening to you
Garrett Masiulis: That's a 99 anywhere where you're a business owner. Not everybody has
their actual, you know, an LLC or something like that, but they are running their own
show. And for us, you know, We, we try, we offer things to try and, and [00:38:00] help
agents through that and you know that this is a high turnover business, both in and out
of the industry and then between brokerages as well.
I think Heron Real Estate's been fortunate with our retention and many that have left
have ended up coming back. But when I talk to agents, when we onboard agents and, and we
ask them why they're considering leaving or brokerages have they been with? What I, So I,
I say what I believe is that oftentimes agents, they're looking for brokerages to solve
their problem.
But they have to take ownership of their problem and solve it themselves and then see
which one of these brokerages will help them Where it'll be a harmonious like help them
with their solving their problem, right? But they have to understand that they have to
kind of take the reins and do the work So at here in real estate, I talked to a bunch of
new agents.
We have a mentorship program that Pairs, experienced agents up with new agents to try and
get through that learning curve. Mm-Hmm. . 'cause we're gonna try and do everything we
can. There's so much to do in real estate. We fool ourselves into thinking we had
productive days just because we were doing things all day.
Mm-Hmm. . And you gotta [00:39:00] understand like what, what is actually gonna bring in
money? Like what is the income producing activity? And even with new mentees in our
program, I tell them like, look, you're going to want to do everything. And in fact, my
aunt was recently licensed and she's no different. I told her she was going to do this
and she's no different.
She's a master at cold calling and that's what her skillset is. And then she calls me and
she's goes, I want to fill up the rest of my day with things like, you know, open houses
and, and all of these other different things that she's then got to learn, take attention
away from learning, like, like this one thing that we know generates income.

And, and it's like, we just need to be hyper focused, have, sometimes you need a mentor
and the accountability to tell you, like, just, we know this works, like we know what
works in real estate. You got to pick something and be, and just stay with it. Stay
persistent with it. And don't chase the shiny objects.
Once you feel comfortable, like you've mastered this or, or not even mastered it, but
comfortable that you understand the process that can make it happen. Then you can start
to explore and expand, but all agents, you know, some do just come and knock it out of
the park.
Tracy Hayes: No, I think you, you hit it. Very well, [00:40:00] they're having only
worked for her and obviously, you know, this is 189th episode.
I've interviewed 170 some different top agents from all over. And someone said it very
well here just recently in the last handful of episodes about why they move around. I
think it was Caitlin Doherty with DJ and Lindsay. They move around because they're,
they're looking for something, but they don't.
They haven't narrowed down what is it they need and every agent is different in what they
need And how they do their business. So there's two different things there. How is that?
So they oftentimes as Caitlin says, don't try to change the brokerage. They have their
way of doing these, find the brokerage that actually has the mindset, the culture you
know, they're doing business.
And then obviously what they're doing is there people there that can help you fill your
weakness. Right.
Garrett Masiulis: Yeah. Yeah. And so it's a, it's an interesting perspective, but I, but
I agree. And, and like the person has to understand that the work has to [00:41:00] come
with them, that with, from within, right, they have to be motivated to do this.
And it isn't, it isn't for everybody, but finding a brokerage that, that in alignment
with that. It is going to be huge. Like there's some brokerages out there that only take
full time. There's some other limitations that make decisions like some brokerages only
take full time agents, right? Or only top producers.
And, and, and that's kind of their identity, right? And so you got to figure out where
you fit. And sometimes where you fit now isn't where you're going to fit in the future.
And so constantly evaluating what services are going to be provided, but you still got to
understand that like, That the problem, the big problem that needs to be solved is often,
you know, it's a, it's an internal problem and you're using the brokerage resources and
tools to help you with that, you know, to help you with that.
But culture, I couldn't say it enough, like if you go to one of our events or even our
just lunch and learns or trainings That is, that is hair in real estate. It's a family
feel. It's an energy. It's a, it's a thing that I can't put words on and that's what
we're most proud of. Working for to having that cultural reputation.
We've grown, you know, we've grown a lot. We've been very fortunate. Some of that had to
do [00:42:00] with the market in the beginning. And the markets changed, you know,
somewhat recently and we've still grown when, when inventory was, you know, You know, it
was changing rapidly. Things weren't selling. Our agent count growth was still, you know,
not to throw numbers out, was still rapidly increasing.
And I handle our brokerage projections, and it's not making sense to my rational mind.
And so when you think about that, finance is a big thing, right? How much you take home.
But having this, the culture and the support and that feeling is you know, some people
put more value in that than others. I understand our owners, like that's what we're most
proud of.
That's what we work with. The

Tracy Hayes: agent needs to like anything, if you don't like what you're doing, you don't
like the people you. have to work with and so forth. It's a downer to get out of bed in
the morning, you know, you try to find, you find excuses not to show up, you know, and
that sort of thing. Do you feel the, you unique Ownership, equity, whatever.
However you just, how do you guys describe it? Call partnership ownership. Equity
partners. Partners. Equity partners. Yeah. Okay. The fact, and there's what? There's
rough, was there six [00:43:00] of you? Six couples, so yeah. Ins of
Garrett Masiulis: couples that David and Christine, right? Yeah. And then five others.
Five, okay. Yeah.
Tracy Hayes: That different than other boutique brokerages who the brokers is generally,
a lot of times the owner.
Mm-Hmm. . Yeah. So they're do, they're dual role, but. No one else really has a true
stake in it where you guys were, obviously the group voted in the next person. All you
had to go through and approve that. And what would that team, what would that couple add
to the overall. But now you're able to field a greater variety of agents with different
needs.
Because I, I think that some brokerages, you know, that broker's probably really good at
something and you go over there, but again, they're only one person and they, and they're
trying to do some of their business. They're trying to, you know, especially there's low
splits and you know, some as any individual, they like to go on vacation and sometimes
they, in life they get tired and they're no longer adding value where there's [00:44:00]
six of you.
So if one of you is on injured reserve, there's five other couples there that can provide
the support and the energy.
Garrett Masiulis: Right. So I so I host our new agent orientations and, and I tell all
the new agents this, when I go over, like who, who is available to help you people that
are on staff that we pay.
And then our owners and I, and I let them know when they see our ownership team picture,
I let them know that every single one of these people on this slide, Our sole purpose is
your success, right? And we're business owners and we're smart, too, right? They have for
us to succeed that our people have to succeed and they're like our their safety nets is
what I call them And you're right because if you have one point of contact one person,
you're only getting one experience Right.
In terms of what they like, what their expertise is. And how many times
Tracy Hayes: these brokers don't even produce anymore. Right. So they're not even really
attached to what's actually going on. Right. Exactly.
Garrett Masiulis: And yeah. And here in real estate, you do. And everybody can reach it.
It's an open door policy. Wide open doors.
Mm hmm. I mean. David should have [00:45:00] his phone like glued to his ear. The man is
he's out there and he's supporting our agents. He's a servant leader. He's really great.
I'm glad that he and Christine are both kind of driving the show here. And leading by
example, but the whole team is the exact same. Yeah, it's a, it's a unique dynamic and
Having a team is, it poses its own challenges.
Let's let's not just scoot by that. Different personalities. Right. And so we've had to
learn as a new company, how, what's important for business. What's important for our
business relationships. How do we stay healthy as partners? How do we focus on continuing
our internal growth to help grow the business as well?
And, and it's been fun and it's been a little bit rocky, but we're human, you know, and
we're still here. We're still loving it. Well, it's such

Tracy Hayes: a kind of tapped on that. I remember I always remember I was telling
somebody this the other day is my wife was explaining that group dynamics, especially if
women they get to about five or six.
Everything's okay. The seventh you're starting to push And then personality start to
[00:46:00] clash Well, you know six or seven you're on the edge right and you because all
of a sudden You know the person who thinks you know, there's always somebody who is
number one, which is probably Christine because you know Dave and Christine started so
she's seen as the Queen and then everybody else is there but when all sudden you get too
many of the The princesses.
Mm-Hmm. . Right. There comes I didn't say that. You did. I said that . I said, I said
that you're all queens. I know you guys are listening, but but the, the group, the fact
that you have a group
Garrett Masiulis: Yeah.
Tracy Hayes: And then somebody comes up with an idea and they're passionate about it,
they're like, oh my God, I lost sleep last night.
We should do this.
Garrett Masiulis: Yeah.
Tracy Hayes: How does this group handle that?
Garrett Masiulis: We're not perfect in that. Yeah. And and so the, whenever. To show you
where we're at in our phases. We're kind of mastering this currently. Okay for full
trans. Is there ever
Tracy Hayes: really a final answer though?
Garrett Masiulis: So like if we can get 70 to 80 percent like we're doing really good,
[00:47:00] right?
Okay but we all have our own opinions our own experiences largely drive like what we feel
is right But whenever we started we were in growth mode and we were all focused on
growth, right? because we needed to pay the bills and whatnot and we had a vision and And
then as a business grows you have to start focusing on like these different business
silos, right?
and sometimes like one silo if you were to look at just finance or sales and marketing or
recruiting or operations or whatever it is Now, although we're still focused on one
primary goal, we still have, we have smaller individual goals that we're focused on, and
a lot of times when it comes to making decisions, once everybody's kind of diverged into
smaller goals, that's when you start to have a lot of that conversation about is this
really right and is this not, is this not right.
David and Christine, they, they listen, though they don't come in with a decision made.
They come in with an open mind and and in fact have been influenced. Like I can, I talk
with both of them in group settings and one on one and all the owners do. And sometimes
like we know whenever we are faced with a challenge, we're having a discussion about it,
[00:48:00] where they stand.
Like we can tell it's kind of no secret body language says a lot. But I do think that at
the end of the day, you know, we're, we're making the best decision and sometimes it's
not always what they came in with a predetermined decision, you know, made on on a
certain topic. Yeah, so it's tough.
You know, it's tough. But honestly, like the hard part about life is working with people.
That is the most challenging thing that there is in life. And so there's no different in
business. It's no different working with customers. And if you work with people who are

open minded, who genuinely care, you know, and it really does take something deeply
rooted like that to it.
To build a strong team. And we got, you know, we got a strong one. I'm proud of everybody
that we work with and we'll buttheads and human, but we respect each other. And at the
end of the day, we know that we got to take care of real estate from where it is today,
at least one step forward tomorrow, two steps forward the next day, we're going to have
the steps back like everybody else does.
And we just got to stay flexible with it.
Tracy Hayes: Yeah. No, I mean, just in our conversation, that's what, you know, that came
up with the. You have six leaders, different [00:49:00] personalities, and you know,
you're, you have a wide net and there's always someone there to back somebody up. And,
you know, you bring on a new agent, there's always, you know, who are they just like a
client, they're going to match with you or your wife.
Well, a new agent coming in, who are they really going to sync with as far as in the
leadership team and feel that they are talking to someone who has a stake in, in, in
what's going on in the, the, the culture and how to affect it? How many agents now?
Garrett Masiulis: So we're at around we got some yesterday and today, and so we're about
like four 74, seven, between four 70 and four 75.
Tracy Hayes: Wow. Okay. I didn't realize it was, I was going to say a hundred something,
maybe 200, wow. 470. And then you got the two offices in orange park and in the one you
opened guys open a couple of years ago on San Jose right there, you and landmark title.
Perfect. Side by side. As an, it's just, there's an agent listening, working with another
brokerage right now, what kind of, cause I think one of the biggest challenges and I'm
sure you've seen it, you've seen it in your [00:50:00] business.
All agents, if they're, they're producing at some point, they, they reach a, I call it
the lid. I'm John Maxwell, the lid, right? They, they reach a point where it's like,
there's only so much they can do themselves. What is the support mechanisms that you guys
have in house at Heron, you know, as far as transaction coordinators, helping them with
the, all the different marketing or social media, whatever, what support people do you
have you know, implanted there?
Garrett Masiulis: So when it comes to like hitting the lid or hitting the ceiling
everybody is going to hit that at a different pace for different reasons. And We transact
like all so we're really big at teaching agents how to leverage and even if it's not
something that We feel like knowledge is power right and so we do offer tools and
resources to help them with how to leverage whether it's connecting Them with transaction
coordinators or using software like CRMs or technology for that matter and helping them
build some structure around how to make that system work for them in a very simple way,
right?
Complex, complex confused minds really [00:51:00] don't progress at anything, right? Or
make decisions. But yeah, so we're, what we like pride ourselves on is, is basically
taking somebody who wants to, wants to be a real estate agent, right? They want to work
in real estate and helping them build the foundation as an independent business.
Right. And so when is a smart time to leverage? How do you leverage? You know, how do you
make the decision on does this, can I afford this? A lot of times it's like, they'll,
somebody will jump to spend money on something. And do no research, right? And not they
just heard other people say that they make money But they don't know the expense or what
time or money is gonna need to go into that
Tracy Hayes: I think there's one thing it's time you're learning how to use it.
Yeah properly. Yeah, right

Garrett Masiulis: exactly Yeah a lot of these tools can be really overwhelming and
they're only and they're geared for somebody who's already gone through and understands
the Foundation and you kind of work your way up to to how to use the more complex tools,
but you certainly don't start there.
And a lot of agents want to, and and they really get kind of discouraged with that. So we
do, we have a wide team when it comes to [00:52:00] business. Like David his background
is in helping doctors grow, grow their practice. Right. And so he went to the UNF and got
a degree in business. And we're running a business, right?
I mean, when it comes to lead generation, you're, you're probably going to leverage
Christine and we all do one on one trainings and group sessions. But we really take a
look at the individual agent because most agents come from something else. I don't often
meet an agent who became an agent in high school or right out of college.
Most of the time they're transitioning because there's something attractive about being
an agent. The number one thing is control of their schedule, right? And then so they
think, so they think, but then, so if you're, if you think about how we're going to be
providing support and what our agents most often use is they're going to be leveraging
David's business expertise and he is open door.
You schedule one on ones with them and they do them all week, all the owners do for that
matter. And you talk about Christine and marketing. Every business is a lead generation
business, business first. And we're looking at these agents to say, what can you leverage
in your past life or your current life?
If you're doing two jobs, right? Often agents are like, how do we take that and,
[00:53:00] and make it work in real estate as well? Like, what is your passions, your
hobbies? What have you previously done? Because David and Christine have individually
done a lot of creative things in terms of marketing. They've spent a lot of money and
figured out what works and what doesn't spent a lot of time.
Like You can dig deep with those two, and then they'll, it's just an interesting
conversation. You've got a lot to learn from them. And our agents do that. And I'm a very
analytical, you know, and so you're going to come to me and I'm going to help you
analyze. You know, David is as well, but I'm going to help you, like, let the data help
you, right?
Oftentimes, a big thing that agents do is farming. They want to do farming. They hate the
fact that there's a delay in gratification, but, and there's money up front that's spent.
But too often, agents will do farming, and they just kind of throw money away. And I help
them dig into the numbers to understand, like, the potential a neighborhood actually has
in terms of gross commission income.
And so it's just being smart around all the facets of owning a business. Even creating a
business entity and understanding, like, the taxes and things like that. We, we, we do
want to help agents. Where they're currently at because a brand new agent [00:54:00] We
are going to tell them stay away from all the distractions and let's focus on one thing
an established agent or Team leaders.
We're going to give them much different advice you
Tracy Hayes: bring up something Very and I hope I hope I hope everyone in here is
listening or if we're now or yeah tomorrow or whatever You said something we like to
bring it to where the agents are at Yes And I don't think if all the people I've spoken
to, I don't know if anyone's can't remember anyone actually talking about when we're
talking about the brokerage and ownership, adding value to the agents, because my next
kind of question was, is retention.
And this comes down to it. You're adding, cause you, if you're not bringing it to them
where they're at or understanding you're where everyone is at. In the 470 agents that you
have now imagine there's probably, you know, we know that 50 percent didn't produce too
much last year. So we, we know that statistic and it's probably true over here.

[00:55:00] And although I did, I do remember seeing something you guys post that you guys
had the most. Most most producing percentage of agents. Yes. So that's definitely
something to brag about. And that says something about your leadership team. I mean,
that's what's moving the needle. You're, you're above average in that because you are
bringing it to where they're at.
And I think Because of your diverse leadership team you know, you got six people looking
at this versus one broker. Maybe they got somebody who they can fight and they already
have their, their mindset on something. It's hard for them to bring it to them where
they're at. And if you're not at where they're at, they eventually say, I need to find
somebody who sees me where I'm at and goes to another brokerage.
Because if there's any success in any brokerage, it's retaining you. Those agents,
because they're hopefully as they longer in their business, the better they do. Right. So
that was just very, I think that's something to say about here. And I think, and I, I
don't know, I would attribute it to say, well, how, well, how are they doing
this?[00:56:00]
It's because you have this equity partnership and everyone's looking at every agent and
how, how can I move every agent, another sale, another deal. Can I get them two more
deals this quarter? Or, you know, maybe there are five more deals for the year or
whatever it is. And you're able to do that with a wider.
of equity partners in, in, in, in David's vision there. Right. And in which then enforced
retain.
Garrett Masiulis: Right. Yeah. Retaining it is a huge thing because we talked about the
turnover and we are lucky and fortunate and the numbers that we retain. I mean, we're no
different. We do lose agents from time to time, and we've been very fortunate that many
of the agents that have left have come back.
In fact, I'm not, of course, I'm gonna say any name. So we've had an agent leave and then
come back. What
Tracy Hayes: did they say? Like, they went over and tested the water over there. Grass
wasn't greener. Did they kind of say?
Garrett Masiulis: Yeah, so the I think this is a hard one because not everybody is going
to be completely open and honest because they, you know, we're humans and we're, we're
sensitive to what other people feel, but but I [00:57:00] do think a lot of it really
does, it comes back down to the culture more than anything.
Okay. And the reason I say that is because like we, you feel the support here and I hate,
I wish there was another way I could describe it. That isn't that everybody isn't saying,
and it's almost like you just got to, Come to an event like our events are open to
everybody. And if you're like curious, what is Garrett even talking about this feel?
You will feel it. I guarantee you will. But that, but we've been fortunate that they've
gone. Yeah. They tested the waters and, and a lot of times, you know, some brokerages
feel like they're a little bit less organized smaller, and then some feel more corporate.
And then I think maybe we're just in a weird kind of sweet spot where we have enough
structure and support that we conduct business professionally, but we still feel like
family at kind of small.
The number isn't small. 478 isn't small, but you go into our office and you know, you're
going to get hit with the smiling faces from our, our lovely, you know, office admin.
They're a great, great resource, a great team of ladies that we have. And that's it,
right? You come in and you get a [00:58:00] smiling face, right?
And we, we just try to keep that consistent and really I keep saying it, man, but it, it,
it is that I think that the retention is primarily the culture because you can go and you
can save money at other brokerages. We're not the only person out there that that you're

gonna save money by signing up with right And so the why are so many coming to hair and
real estate outside if you just put that piece aside Your family does right?
That's it. Right?
Tracy Hayes: I'm gonna I'm gonna kind of change and then I'm gonna go back. I want to go
back to the Garrett group and you and Erica Both of you are native To the area. What are
you doing as real estate agents? What is your go to marketing? What works for you? I
mean, over the last, you know, roughly four years now you, you're out there regular, what
have you find is your sweet spot?
Garrett Masiulis: So I think that any like anybody that's a native somewhere, they have
that unfair advantage because they grew up with people and we're both, you know, pretty
social. And so we're Erica
Tracy Hayes: from Orange Park or where she is. She's an orange parking too. [00:59:00]
Yeah. Okay.
Garrett Masiulis: And and so most of our business is going to come from friends, family,
spirit, past people that we've met.
Having an engineering background, I got, you know, a large group Massive people there
that know me professionally And you know that just knowing somebody, that you can trust
is a big deal And so it's kind of an unfair advantage there as well. And so and I always
talk about real estate So we our focus is with just between us is it's just keeping
people in the know about what's going on in the community, and we do that through print
or social media advertising or phone calls or text, and so we're just constantly touching
our sphere.
We use KVCOR, that our brokerage offers, and so we can put out newsletters and we put out
blogs, and this podcast, like this platform, I love it, and eventually we'd love to do
something like that, maybe for the brokerage as well but that's more brokerage oriented,
but yeah. So doing that is huge.
And I've dabbled with the other things like cold calling and driving for dollars, things
I did for the investing side before being a real estate agent. But what feels the most
natural to us is it's just leveraging the people that we know. And [01:00:00] I tell
every agent, any new agent, You know, they're like, Hey, what does the database look
like?
Well, it looks like that. Sorry. I got a crack. Everybody's got a database, right? And
this is always right next to everybody. And there
Tracy Hayes: are, there are apps that'll pull that off for you. Put in an Excel
spreadsheet for free. Exactly. Just
Garrett Masiulis: figuring out like just figuring out how to follow up with people.
And then and understanding that whenever we follow up with people, they're going to be
more receptive to any time you can, you can let them know something. I say value, but it
could just be sometimes a phone call saying, Hey, Hey, it's Garrett. I haven't talked to
you in a month or two or whatever it is.
And I just want to know if there's anything I can help you with. And a lot of times, you
know, just that kind of question is gonna, they're like, wait, it's not just real estate.
I can do much more than just real estate. So just figuring out ways to stay in touch and
provide value. And my wife's really good at understanding what goes on around town.
And we like to go out with our kids. We bring our kids everywhere. And you know, we're
going to do activities that are family friendly. And a lot of times we attract that type
of customer as well. That's got, that's got young kids and similar interest and just
being ourselves. [01:01:00]

Tracy Hayes: Well, you know, as I had what the two very young ladies on, you know, there,
there are nine, you know, 24, they've had great first and second years where they're at.
So we were talking about that. But I think People, you know, you and I have kids, so
we're involved in those activities, ball fields and all that kind of thing going on. And
we forget that there are people pre kids and there are people post kids that are out
there that are not you know, socializing at the bus to op, you know, they're not, you
know, at the birthday parties every weekend, and that kind of thing going on that they
need to be.
brought in touch to, you know, and sending these messages out to them, letting them know,
cause they're buying and selling real estate. Hopefully, you know, the pre might be
buying their first home. They might be downsizing or, or who knows buying their kid a
home or ready. Now the kids are out. Maybe they, they are looking to invest, you know,
telling them where they're at in their careers and stuff.
And I think we forget that, you know, we're in this kind of middle swath with [01:02:00]
raising kids. We got all this stuff going on. They don't necessarily have all those extra
social activities going on.
Garrett Masiulis: Yeah. So from my perspective is I, I try and like pick your ideal
customer, right? Because we're not going to be the right person for everybody.
And so for where I'm at today, sitting in this chair with a five and six year old and a
wife and all of the things that we have going on, we have things as a family that, that
we, we enjoy doing. We have in common activities and, and, Our ideal customer is going to
largely be the people that are attracted to the same types of things that we are.
Tracy Hayes: The tricks, like, yeah. Right, exactly.
Garrett Masiulis: And like, the, the first time home buyer, like, if you see the stuff
that we put out it's probably not going to be Like let's say somebody who's just got it
like buying a house when they're in college or maybe they haven't graduated or just
graduated And they're trying to buy a house just naturally the type of people that we
are.
I can absolutely service that person I've been there, right? But we are our lives have
events that take place and then we put those events out there We try and let people know
[01:03:00] who we are today And so and so generally that's going to attract a type of
person, but you're right. There's people out there that are, that don't have kids and
will never have kids or people that have had many kids that have, you know, that need to,
well,
Tracy Hayes: you know, you're sitting there dealing with another, you know, like peer and
those has a family and they have parents.
Yeah. They have aunt and uncles who might live locally or so forth that, you know, you
get into those circles and you've, you've got to you know, again, you don't know what
information and you don't know when they're going to be ready to buy real estate, right?
Yeah, exactly. Yeah.
Garrett Masiulis: So you just got to, like, I talk about it all the time.
My wife is a little bit different than me in that fact is that I just can't help it. I've
been in love with real estate, like through the investing side and a lot of times I'll
segue into that. Right. But I, but I talk about it all the time. The special touches
really come from from my wife, you know, and so I talk about it.
I'm like kind of a little feel like I have the knowledge and my wife has the personal
touch, you know, and And it's like sometimes the [01:04:00] simple thing like, you know,
when somebody's birthday, right? It's like that is everybody likes to hear happy
birthday. Everybody's favorite word on the planet is their first name, right?

You know, and it's things like leave it to the engineer to Totally blow through all that
stuff, , and then she saves me, you know, right. She saw the other, I mean, really when
it comes to generating business your own backyard is a real good place to start if, if
you're a new agent. Right. And you know, my wife started sourdough bread, like I think
everybody did.
I don't know. Apparently it's like this huge social media craze with, with sourdough
bread. Did you know that? No, I did not know that. , the first time I see you, I'll have
to bring some that she makes, but she makes so much. That must
Tracy Hayes: be why my dad does it. He like, he's in. making. He hasn't done that since I
was 40 years.
Yeah, now he's making, he made bread for, we had obviously Easter. You made a loaf of
bread. Yeah.
Garrett Masiulis: But I went with my sons and she made a lot of sourdough bagels and we
went and handed them out to our neighbors. And so like, I just think you should be smart
though. Like, let's not do like these sporadic gifts.
They're, they're great. But if you're going to do it as, as a part of a, your business
model, then there's gotta [01:05:00] be the consistency, you know, behind it. And so
getting bagels once is great. But if you're, you You know, you just gotta be consistent
with whatever it is, however you're putting your name and your service in front of these
individuals or the fact that you're able to help.
You just gotta be consistent.
Tracy Hayes: Do agents you mentioned it earlier about We were talking about some sort of
marketing and understanding. It's long term Really a lot of what a lot of unless you're
buying hot leads or someone, you know They went on your site and you're looking at
houses. Okay, that person may be ready may be ready to buy right now they may be just
curious in that house because I don't know.
Maybe they grew up there grew up in the neighborhood or their friend owner who knows
whatever whatever reason but That Everything you do has to be have to have a long term
play in the consistency that you're talking about It can't you know the social media we
people are well, do you get business off social media?
No, social media is a long term play and I don't think you ever can measure whether you
do or not It's a tool to stay top of mind You know, I know they they put all their stuff
on instagram [01:06:00] the kids all that But all it's on instagram so that all their
friends can see What they're doing and oh, hey, by the way, i'm selling houses, too,
Garrett Masiulis: right?
Yeah, and and
Tracy Hayes: It's a long term.
Garrett Masiulis: Yeah, the long term play. And a lot of times, you know, when you real
estate lead is can be defined in many ways, right? And sometimes they're hot, sometimes
they're cold. But you're right. It's the long term play. And really, like, we should all
be trying to figure out what the problem is.
And it's funny because you go into a store. And you walk into the store, you know you're
gonna go buy a pair of tennis shoes. Let's say you go into Dick's Sporting Goods or
wherever, you're gonna buy some sneakers. And the person at the front says, Hey, you
know, Tracy, can I help? They don't know your name or whatever.
Hey, can I help you find something? And you say, no, I'm just, I'm good. And so we were
so people are being sold. I can't, and I've got the amount of times every single day and
we are really good at saying no, you know, putting up an objection and basically just

trying to dodge the salesperson. But we all have a, you're in a store like you didn't
just happen to walk into his [01:07:00] wake.
You're up, you know, wake up and say, oh, I'm in a store, you know, no, you're there for
a purpose. If a lead is calling you or somebody is reaching out to you. It's for a reason
and just don't just don't expect especially if you don't know them that you're going to
get to that The cause you know understand their problem, but that should be what what
we're doing And you can't just hammer it.
You can't people are you know, people are people you can't just say what is your problem?
And then again, what is your problem? What is your problem? When they say provide value
You're trying to build a rapport, build a trust, somebody that they know, like and trust,
right? But at the end of the day, we've got to figure out what the problem is so that we
can help solve the problem.
And hopefully it's real estate related, right? That's what we're doing. But sometimes
you'll find out that it isn't, right? And so maybe, maybe their problem, they think they
want to sell their house for instance, but maybe there's a, there's a trust problem or a
divorce or something else that actually needs to be solved and they don't even need to
sell their house, you know?
Right. Sometimes that happens, but you don't know until you, And so that's your focus is
to, to, well,
Tracy Hayes: since we're on the, on the value subject you guys had a large meeting.
You're [01:08:00] all, I guess, all hair and meeting at landmark the other day using
their facility and the NAR lawsuit was, was part of it.
I've had numerous, had a couple of attorneys from, from landmark on the show, several
episodes ago, talking about the, this proposed. settlement, but it's in the air and we
are using the term value. Patty Ketchum, Florida commission, well known Florida realtor
instructor. She, you know, we're loosely using the term value out there.
What is Heron? What, what were you guys the gist of the conversation that you guys were
having at landmark in, you know, bringing. Because I think obviously there there's a lot
of click baiters out there on social media I know there's one guy out there right now
saying hey, you know, don't pay for a real estate Just call me and I'll you know, pay me
a few hundred dollars and I'll tell you how to do it yourself Yes, this guy's on tick
tock.
I wanted to say something, but I'm like, no, there's already 10, 000 already comments. I
don't need all the [01:09:00] You know type of thing But what it what is the message that
that the leadership team of Heron is getting across to their team?
Garrett Masiulis: So I wasn't there at this. Unfortunately, I was away at being a best
man at my best friend's wedding.
But I think the thing is, is you, you mentioned seeing on social media there is a lot of
like chaos, uncertainty, anxiety, and it can, it can be overwhelming when something
changes in the industry. And, and sometimes it's a shame because some of what's being
communicated isn't, isn't really new news, right?
That's new news, even something, but But, you know, because what I'll see out there is
the 6 percent commission is no longer paying and they're posting all of these things that
weren't really real to begin with. And so I do think that it's proposed, right? We're
trying to understand it but not, you know, not get too far ahead of ourselves.
And that's why we leverage the folks at Landmark, you know, because, you know, they're
attorneys and really when it comes down to, like, understanding this, we need to bring in
some people that are more experts than we are. Right. Right. But just when it comes to
like a listing [01:10:00] agent and, and a buyer's agent and they bring different value
to the customers that they're working with.

And you got to understand a way to communicate the value because oftentimes the real
estate agents feel or get told that like, we're not worth, we, oh, your job's too easy.
What, what are you actually doing? And gosh, if I could just have, Because a lot of
Tracy Hayes: us love, you know, a lot of agents love what they do and it makes it look
easy.
Yeah,
Garrett Masiulis: right It's not
Tracy Hayes: easy, but they just make it easy because they love doing it.
Garrett Masiulis: I wish all of the agents Anytime they hit a speed bump in the
transaction Like if we could make, you know, the month of April, you have to air out your
dirty laundry or show the problems with what you're doing. And then I think that would
help people realize that like, yes, it's fun.
It's exciting, but it's hard. It's a lot of work and working with a particular customer.
You're providing value for that customer while you're working with them. But there's a
lot of energy just to get in front of these people, you know, and so we, you I don't
think people even understand the overhead costs as it relates to running a business or
being a real [01:11:00] estate agent.
And so really what we're trying to communicate is that like, let's not all kind of freak
out about what's going on. Let's respect the changes that are proposed and understand
like the real implications and then figure out how as a real estate agent, do you still
communicate and provide value and still get paid and can make a living and be extremely
successful?
Because I don't think that. I think some agents are fearing that the the world's ending
and it's certainly not the case, right? I think
Tracy Hayes: they're choosing that there's because you know There's some that i've been
thinking about getting out for a long time and they're just going to use this as an
excuse, right?
Garrett Masiulis: Right, exactly. You're right. And and honestly if that's if that's the
case then you know, maybe they weren't Going to provide the best service. Anyway, you
know, I don't really know. We can't predict like that. Is the agent Count going to be
impacted. Is it? Yes. Is it? No. How much right? It's like a lot of speculation on this
but we can certainly project and see some things that that that are going to happen as it
relates to the number of agents Actively selling real estate.
Would you
Tracy Hayes: would you agree? It's it's just important to know should which I think it's
it's actually, [01:12:00] you know How many of the non real estate industry people are
actually paying attention to this going on? My question obviously was to one of the
attorneys was You This is not some legislation. This is a, a, a settlement and they're
going to try to tell us that that's the law, that the terms don't, they can't mix.
And until, and I think so legislation needs to come in involved. That's what needs to be
to set, set the tone. But for an agent right now is how to respond. Should someone say,
well, I heard this was negotiable. Yes you're, it is negotiable. Here's what we're. You
know, providing, you know, it's probably that conversation is going to happen in the
listing appointment more than the buyers, you know, consultation, but, you know, and
explain the value.
And then, Hey, this is what's going on. This is your competition right now. We need to
offer two and a half, 3 percent to the. Buyers agent, you know a type of thing because
you know, you know what they're doing Someone did this great. [01:13:00] There's there's
been some great reels by agents role playing back and forth and showing well, yeah You

know, this is what it's going to cost you Yeah, if they took ten thousand dollars off the
four hundred thousand dollar purchase price because they didn't pay the buyer's agent But
how would you, you know, what's that going to actually cost you bringing to the table?
I think it was a great real, I might have reposted it on my, on my page. But just
knowing, knowing that what are, besides the NAR lawsuit, our market has obviously changed
in the last 18 to 24 months. Rates are up. I see every morning. I tell people on listen
to Bloomberg. They're talking out of both sides of their mouth on rate drops this
morning.
Oh, they're, they're still expecting, you know, I still expect to see a rate drop by the
end of second quarter, you know, three this year. But then someone else says as well, if
they drop the rates, it means they think the economy is not doing well. But in all But
with unemployment low and all, they're saying the economy is strong.
So why would they drop the rate? So there's all this contradiction going on and I don't,
I don't think we can wait around for that. I think [01:14:00] people have been waiting
around for that and we've got all these buyers now sitting on the sidelines. Timing,
Garrett Masiulis: timing the market, as you know, is impossible to do, both in real
estate's generally a slower moving market than the equities market or bond market, for
instance, but timing it is not, is not something that you know, that anybody should be
trying to.
Focus their efforts on because you're going to generally speaking lose out. But yeah, I
think that like from a macro economy standpoint Like there's a lot of indicators that
that are healthy indicators And then it's like when you look at data like you think about
i'm big into fantasy football, so i'm I'm, sorry for those that aren't But you can take a
player's statistics and make them look like a superstar or make them look like a dud
Right.
And so that's what people do with the data and the lay person that's trying to consume
this and make sense out of it has a real tough time. So getting a little bit educated on
it is important, but it takes time too. I do think that waiting on the sideline, like I,
like I said in the beginning, like finding a way to buy a house.
It it, Is what I think should be the goal, right? [01:15:00] For like owning real estate.
I understand everybody's unique situation is different, but owning real estate is a big
wealth generator. If you, if you approach it intelligently. But yeah, it's tough. Like,
so what, what is the market doing? You know, when rates dropped towards the end of last
year, beginning of this year, and they kind of ticked down a little bit and things boomed
and then like the messages come out and they're mixed and.
They're closely monitoring inflation, of course, right? And they're, they're basically
saying inflation numbers are not where we want them to be. And that's one of the reasons
that's one of the things that's going to affect the rates and, and understanding what
affects the rates. You know, you're more qualified than I am at a mortgage backed
securities, the 10 year treasury, like there's so much that goes into like the interest
rate that the consumer sees.
It's just, it's a challenging thing to, to try and time and understand. Well,
Tracy Hayes: you and I have seen. You know, well, I'm a little older than you, but for
most of my career, you know, I was there pre 2000. It was, it was November, 2008 when the
rates started to drop because the quantitative ease of our own, our own trade, we're
buying mortgage backed [01:16:00] securities.
And we saw that for 15 years. And you know, many people have. Growing up and saw these 3
percent interest rates and they think that that's normal. And then, and now of course we
try to tell them it's not, but on the other side, we have the challenge of supply chain
because our government has gotten involved with too many regulations.

The cost of bringing the goods to the table and build that house has gone up. So now, now
all of a sudden you've got high rates and high costs.
Garrett Masiulis: Yeah.
Tracy Hayes: You know, now you've got affordability is, is out the window you know, from
that standpoint. So the challenges that, and all the different things that are involved
in that, it's not just the interest rate.
Yeah,
Garrett Masiulis: it is. It's so much more. You know,
Tracy Hayes: what are you paying for a gallon of milk? What are you paying? Golly
chicken. Can you imagine? I mean, bars used to have nice 50 cent wings. I mean, you
can't, you're paying 1. 52 for a wing. It's
Garrett Masiulis: across the board and it hurts. Yeah. I think I filled up my gas tank
yesterday or the day before and it was 4.
30 something cents for premium gas. [01:17:00] And and it hurts all across the board. And
you know, you're going to see when it comes to that pain, like you're going to see the
indicators in terms of consumer debt and things like that, like that, that start to inch
up and creep up. And and we talk about the economy as a whole is the soft landing, or is
it going to crash?
Like, what's going to, you know, what's going to happen? And gosh, I wish we knew, but
Tracy Hayes: you just, you just actually hit on the consumer debt part. Because if we do
see, if the rates go to 5. 875, On a 30 year fix, we are going to have a refi boom
because, because of the amount of consumer debt. And like we said, 55 percent of people
were paying cash.
There's so much equity in a lot of these homes right now. Nationally, actually there's a
tremendous amount of equity. They're going to have to tap into that to pay off those
credit cards as they were doing in 2005 and six. And I was doing some crazy loans, you
know, cash out the 95 percent of the value of the home in paying off 50 60 70, 000 in
credit cards.
People were paying
Garrett Masiulis: off credit cards. They were buying [01:18:00] toys. They were taking
that money, investing in the stock market. I mean, they were doing a lot of things, you
know, and but you're right. Yeah, if we hit a refi market where people are can get lower
their payment and capture some equity and do something with that.
Yeah, the consumer debt is high and and that's like a sign that things are beginning to
break, right, for everybody. And I don't care if you're, you know, making 50, 000 a year
or 500 or a million or whatever it is. Like, you're, you're, the pain is felt across the
board whenever people we all, nobody learns how to manage finances in school, right,
right?
And so we all learn the hard way, unless you have, you're fortunate to have a mentor or a
parent that does. And that learning the hard way is, Credit cards often, you know, I
mean, it's a big deal and those rates
Tracy Hayes: they drive. They get us in college early Garrett anything you want to add to
our conversation today?
Garrett Masiulis: I've had a blast. I think that I appreciate you know, the opportunity
Like I said, like I love real estate, but here in real estate is In my opinion, that's my
favorite thing. Well,

Tracy Hayes: I'm extending the [01:19:00] invitation out to any one of your ownership
group. Now, I won't have you all in a row. Maybe one a month or something like that to
come out.
Because I'm sure everyone has a little different angle, but then everyone also has a
little different story. And that's actually if Christine remembers one time, she said why
she wasn't coming on wasn't because she was shy. It was another reason. We'll talk about
that off camera. But I said, it's not, I don't care.
I want. I want your story. People need to hear your story because hopefully some agents
that were listening are now interested in Heron motivated, maybe some ideas that you were
talking about. Investing might call you and Erica and say, Hey, we'd like to have coffee
with you and pick your brain on, on that.
Cause we'd like to start investing or flipping or whatever it might be and, and feel they
can have that conversation with you now that they know you a little bit.
Garrett Masiulis: Yeah. Well, I appreciate the outlet. I love what you're doing. Like I
said, I, I watched your, your shows before And it is interesting to see everybody's
perspective, and that's the beauty of it.
Like, we're all, we're all people figuring this thing out ourselves, and what works for
me may not work for them. But, the rest of the owners, I'll share that with them. And
we'll see if we can get somebody else on here to share their story. Appreciate [01:20:00]
it. Thanks. Thanks, Cam. Thank you.